had a friend come over to sort that out but am working on scripting the objects for both jaws and window eyes. window eyes 5.5 seems to support sonar 4 very well here as a test run. I'm wondering if anyone can get in touch with me off list re any versions of supernova or hal. please do not think nor suggest over the site that I'm stealing software. this is actually to request old or spare software to run an organization for blind children in the UK lew