[bct] Re: Making things cross disability accessible

  • From: "Vince Thacker" <vince@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sat, 25 Feb 2006 04:11:44 -0000

Joni,

You make very good sense. I know my accessibility needs are pretty well inside out to those of a completely sightless person, though I'm legalThis was blind just the same.

This was illustrated pretty clearly when I was on a course recently and tried to share a computer with another student. She used JAWS, I was trying to use ZoomText, which were both installed on the machine. You'd appreciate the complications of such a thing - in the end I asked my fellow student to stick to JAWS and I'd just listen and pitch in with some talk about the piece of research we were doing.


Your husband's total colour blindness is really hard luck - I've got the ordinary deuteranopia red/green thing that a lot of white males get, where the colourblind test cards all just look like Maryland cookies. My cones must be shot to some extent too, and I get a lot of glare, which is very tiring as the day wears on. I can go out on a beautiful summer's day and to me it looks like a video gone out of tune, mixed in with overexposure effects. At night, I can go out and see street lights clearly and am in some ways better off in the dark! So I guess my rods are pretty much OK.



People who should know better print things in a way that are undecipherable to your husband, and me, for that matter. Our local Council, who are supposed to be so disability friendly, once published a booklet where the titles were all in lime green and the background colour was a sort of lilac. Apart from looking yucky anyway, that was impossible to read. If they'd looked at it converted to greyscale, maybe they'd have understood what I'm talking about. I'm better at sorting out what colour is what if the colours have at least a different refractive index.


Shops drive me mad when they keep changing packaging. For example, cod used to be in blue boxes, and haddock in green. Primary colours, not problem. The green was a bit darker than the blue, so maybe your husband could have told the difference. Now they've changed all that and both cod and haddock are in sort of - um, not sure, sort of bluey-greeney, turqoisey, boxes, different shades but not much different. On a good day I might be able to see which is haddock because it's a longer word, but that's about it.


So, yet another conundrum in the accessibility business. When I've put web pages together, I get around it by being boring - not too complicated is the rule, and usually white text on dark background, with maybe a different colour to mark the heads of tables, and you just hope that screen readers know what the <TH> tag is. Sometimes I've included a tool to let people choose their own colours, but that can be a tricky business too.


Having good people around can solve most accessibility problems, it seems to me - and in the shop it's up to me to waylay someone if I get stuck and ask them nicely to look at something for me.

When something's imposed, like printed material, well, that's different, but if I can contact someone to say it's impossible to use something, there's
generally some kind of workaround. Some organisations get very defensive and say "do you want to make a complaint about this?" and I usually have to say something like, "No, what I'd really like is you to e-mail me an electronic version that I can magnify or have spoken to me."


This is starting to sound like a personal blog, and maybe I'd better stop!


Vince.



----- Original Message ----- From: "Joni Colver" <joni.colver@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 1:39 AM
Subject: [bct] Re: Making things cross disability accessible



Vince my husband is partially sighted and totally color blind. It is
amazing to me the number of things we come across that are color coded!
Reading black on red, as on some grocery store items, is extremely difficult
for him. He uses ZoomText, while I use JFW.




He never knew what was wrong with his eyes until he had some testing done at
Vanderbilt Hospital about ten or twelve years ago. The retina has both
cones and rods normally. He has no cones at all. cones help a person see
in bright light, and see colors. He has severe light sensitivity.




I think that perhaps mobility impaired people in wheelchairs have more
clear-cut needs and requests for accessibility. They seem to speak with one
voice, whereas sometimes different blindness-oriented groups are more
splintered in their accessibility efforts. Any wheelchair can use a ramp to
enter a restaurant but only some blind people can read a Braille menu.
There are so many different levels of visual impairment and people have
different needs according to their current level. As those of us with
progressive eye diseases know too well, those levels change over time.




Joni





----- Original Message ----- From: "Vince Thacker" <vince@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 4:04 PM
Subject: [bct] Re: Making things cross disability accessible



Hi Neal, All difficult stuff, I agree, but it's good when people at least try to cater for as wide a range of people as possible.

I once worked for a disability advocacy organisation with 7 staff and some
volunteers. Because someone in the early days had thought about inclusion,
they had deisgned the office systems and publishing side so that we could
easily produce everything in large print, braille and audio tape. Then we
added 5 Asian languages to the audio tape side. Occasionally we even managed
a sign-language video for deaf people. We didn't get everything right - the
official t-shirt included some upside-down Hindi - but it wasn't a bad shot.


It's good if programs don't actively bock the settings you've made in your
operating system that work for you. The Switch suite of audio programs seems
really good in this respect. True there are some awkward buttons that are
hard to see but they have tooltips explaining them and it looks as if you
could use the menus instead. These are only different ways of pointing to
the same functions after all. Each program has a distinctive icon, where
other programs have things that might as well be blobs of jelly. It only
takes simple things like thtat to make a difference sometimes.


On the other hand, Adobe Acrobat imposes its own ideas on the display and
for me they are disastrous and unmanageable.

No idea why one group has more clout than another, unless it's just that
some disabilities are easier to understand than others. But in my old
organisation, the people in wheelchairs were the ones that made most noise,
as it happens - possibly because they had more unmet needs.


This could be a long discussion and maybe slightly off topic, but raises all
sorts of fundamental questions nonetheless.
Vince.



----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Ewers" <neal.ewers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 7:39 PM
Subject: [bct] Making things cross disability accessible



Vince, You said, "People with visual stress, dyslexics, those with
limited movement and deaf
people all present different needs too, so it's no wonder things aren't
quite perfect yet!"

What can sometimes be troubling is the hard work that goes in to making
something cross disability accessible.  There seem to be people in each
disability community who will work their heads off to get something they
need even if it means that the product is not accessible to people who
have other disabilities.  And there are some disability groups that seem
to have more clout than others.  Why, for example, does the Randolph
Shepard act say that people who are blind have first rights to vending
stands.  In years past, those stands were quite small and often sold
candy, smokes, etc.  Now, some of them are large food service
establishments.  So, why is someone who is blind more qualified to run
such an establishment than someone who is in a wheel chair, or deaf, or
has no arms?  But you can be assured, that if congress decided to give
other disability groups equal rights to this perk, a lot of people who
are blind would be ready to fight that change with all their might.  So,
now you see how hard it is to work with groups of people with varying
disabilities.  I did this at Trace all the time, and it could be some of
the most divisive posturing I have ever seen.


Neal


-----Original Message----- From: blindcooltech-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:blindcooltech-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Vince Thacker Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 12:41 PM To: blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [bct] Re: FW: Introducing DbDialog: a free, accessible database manager


Neal,

I have to admit accessibility is a darned complicated theing, as I know
from
trying to create accessible web pages and failing miserably sometimes.
People with visual stress, dyslexics, those with limited movement and
deaf
people all present different needs too, so it's no wonder things aren't
quite perfect yet!

Vnice.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Ewers" <neal.ewers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 4:32 PM
Subject: [bct] Re: FW: Introducing DbDialog: a free, accessible database


manager


Vince, you say, "When I run it I don't see any scaleable fonts, any
color contrasts."

Thank you for pointing out that many people who may be on this list
may have some limited vision.  We often get so rapped up in speech and

braille that we forget about those who need color contrast, large
text, etc.  Thanks for keeping us on our toes.

Neal


-----Original Message----- From: blindcooltech-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:blindcooltech-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Vince Thacker Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 9:52 AM To: blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [bct] Re: FW: Introducing DbDialog: a free, accessible database manager


I've had a quick look at this and have to ask my usual question, "What

do you mean by accessible?"

When I run it I don't see any scaleable fonts, any colour contrasts or

even a single Tooltip.  Every time I press anything I get an error
message that
is basically a line of code with ifs and thens.

Very ppor job in my opinion.
Vince.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jamie Pauls" <jamiepauls@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <accesscomp@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <blindcooltech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 11:35 PM
Subject: [bct] FW: Introducing DbDialog: a free, accessible database
manager




-----Original Message-----
From: blindtech@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:blindtech@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On

Behalf Of Jamal Mazrui
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 2:40 PM
To: blindtech@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Introducing DbDialog: a free, accessible database manager

Now available at
http://www.empowermentzone.com/dbdsetup.exe

Since developing database applications under DOS in the early 1990s,
I have had a goal of developing them under Windows.  Thus, I am
pleased to announce
DbDialog:  a free database manager.  It achieves a high level of both
functionality and accessibility by exploiting capabilities of
standard
Windows controls.

The program supports tables of records in Microsoft Access format.
Once a table is defined, records may be created, modified, browsed,
searched, and output in an efficient manner.  Initially, sample
tables

are defined for tracking contacts, events, and albums.  Complete
documentation is available in an HTML file with structured headings.

I welcome feedback and contributions toward the improvement of
DbDialog.

Regards,
Jamal


BlindTech is a service of MosenExplosion.com. To find out about the other e-mail lists we run, please visit us on the web at http://www.MosenExplosion.com Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/blindtech/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
   blindtech-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
   http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/









--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.12/265 - Release Date:
2/20/2006









-- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.12/265 - Release Date:
2/20/2006









--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.12/265 - Release Date: 2/20/2006










-- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.12/265 - Release Date: 2/20/2006





Other related posts: