[bksvol-discuss] Re: asterisks
- From: Cindy <popularplace@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 16:06:50 -0700 (PDT)
Thanks Mayrie. I can imagine that 5 would be annoying to hear;
Cindy
--- On Sat, 5/28/11, Mayrie ReNae <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> From: Mayrie ReNae <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What is Daisy?
> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Date: Saturday, May 28, 2011, 2:15 PM
> Hi Cindy,
>
> Please use three asterisks to denote white space.
>
> Thank you.
>
> Mayrie
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> On Behalf Of Cindy
> Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2011 1:05 PM
> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What is Daisy?
>
> Thanks, Roger I read this after I responded to your earlier
> post. Now I understand better why the headings have to
> be as they are supposed to be. I still wonder ow many
> asterisks are most desirable. Are 5 too many? 3 too
> few?
> Cindy
>
>
>
> --- On Sat, 5/28/11, Roger Loran Bailey <rogerbailey81@xxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
> > From: Roger Loran Bailey <rogerbailey81@xxxxxxx>
> > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What is Daisy?
> > To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Date: Saturday, May 28, 2011, 10:00 AM Cindy, Daisy
> stands for digital
> > accessible information system. It can be text, audio
> or text and audio
> > Daisy. It is a collection of files that work together
> to allow for
> > navigation through a book. That is, the intention is
> to make the
> > reading experience for blind people closer to that of
> the sighted
> > people. Personally, when I use a Daisy book I do
> listen to them. I use
> > the audio Daisy books from the NLS BARD site which are
> recorded human
> > voices and I use the Daisy books from Bookshare in
> which case I listen
> > to a synthetic voice read them, but if you are sighted
> it should not
> > be a problem to read them visually.
> > Braille is another matter, though. I don't think Daisy
> will work with
> > Braille. You might want to take a look at the FAQ at
> Open Library.
> > They give an explanation of Daisy there and I think
> there is a link to
> > a site that is all about Daisy and should give an even
> better
> > explanation, but I have never actually bothered to
> take a look at that
> > site myself.
> >
> >
> > _ _ _
> >
> > "One of the things that is wrong with religion is that
> it teaches us
> > to be satisfied with answers which are not really
> answers at all." -
> > Richard Dawkins
> >
> > Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/rogerbailey81
> >
> >
> > The Militant:
> > http://www.themilitant.com
> > Pathfinder Press:
> > http://www.pathfinderpress.com
> > Granma International:
> > http://www.granma.cu/ingles/index.html
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cindy" <popularplace@xxxxxxxxx>
> > To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 5:26 PM
> > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] What is Daisy?
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm a little late in asking this question. smile. I've
> assumed people
> > who use a Daisy reader listen to the books.
> > What is a Daisy standard, and how does it differ from
> what Braille
> > readers need? I'd like to make my proofs easy for both
> groups.
> > Cindy
> >
> > Whoever has time to answer this question cAN explain
> to me offlist
> >
> > --- On Fri, 5/27/11, Scott Rains <scottr@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > From: Scott Rains <scottr@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: bolds, italics,
> > ellipses
> > > To: "bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx"
> > <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Date: Friday, May 27, 2011, 12:12 PM Hi All,
> > >
> > > My public apology to Mayrie for posting a note
> that I intended to be
> > > private. For the record, Mayrie's grasp of the
> > technical
> > > and policy world
> > > we work in is top-notch. I count on her knowledge
> to
> > guide
> > > me. The advice
> > > she gives you here on the list is sound.
> > >
> > > On this particular issue, as with several others,
> we balance what
> > > you might call "multiple jurisdictions." What you
> see in
> > the
> > > manual reflects
> > > that balancing act. We use the manual to lay down
> the baseline so
> > > that this group can mentor new volunteers on the
> trickier points.
> > >
> > > Bookshare is being visited this week by the
> person
> > who
> > > oversees our
> > > federal government contract to add textbooks to
> the collection. She
> > > is full of praise for the combined work of
> volunteers
> > and
> > > staff. She
> > > explicitly mentioned that she, and others in
> > government
> > > agencies, have
> > > noticed the improved quality of our books over
> the
> > past
> > > five years. That
> > > is a credit to each of you. It also means that
> we
> > have
> > > several audiences
> > > to please on issues that do not always have neat
> > answers.
> > >
> > > Sometimes standards of quality conflict. We try
> to
> > balance.
> > > Some technical
> > > solutions that are the best for members are not
> > supported
> > > by readers'
> > > software or hardware yet. Sometimes what works
> best
> > in
> > > Braille is less
> > > elegant in RTF or vice versa. When we are faced
> with conflicting or
> > > emerging standards we defer to the DAISY
> standard.
> > That is
> > > what we ask the
> > > publishing industry to do. In the absence of a
> DAISY standard,
> > > keeping I mind the current limits of readers and
> AT, we try to
> > find a
> > > balance that
> > > does not put a burden on proofreaders yet also
> meets
> > the
> > > needs members.
> > >
> > > The manual evolves. Part of the way it does so
> is
> > with
> > > discussions like
> > > these.
> > >
> > > Scott
> > >
> > > On 5/27/11 9:27 AM, "Debby Franson" <the.bee@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >Hi Scott and everyone!
> > > >
> > > >I agree that the manual isn't giving
> optional
> > > information. I just wish
> > > >the
> > > >manual was updated to agree with
> transcribing
> > rules so
> > > these discussions
> > > >wouldn't have to come up again and again so
> that
> > > instructions given onlist
> > > >and in the manual would agree. When new
> > > volunteers come aboard, the
> > > >discussions fly through the list again. I
> > > appreciate it that we
> > > >volunteers
> > > >want to do the right thing so that the books
> will
> > be
> > > well-formatted and
> > > >accurate.
> > > >
> > > >I hope readers have a good reading experience
> no
> > matter
> > > what method is
> > > >chosen for reading.
> > > >
> > > >Debby
> > > >
> > > >At 04:59 PM 5/25/2011, Scott Rains wrote
> > > >>Mayrie,
> > > >>
> > > >>Let me rein you in on a point below.
> > > >>
> > > >>We never want to be telling people that
> the
> > manual
> > > is giving optional
> > > >>activities that aren't required. Bold
> and
> > italic,
> > > like font size, are
> > > >>required.
> > > >>
> > > >>They may be required for different
> reasons.
> > Font
> > > size is what DAISY
> > > >>navigates on so is technically required
> for
> > > navigation. Italics are most
> > > >>often in the book so required as part of
> our
> > > adherence to retaining the
> > > >>integrity of the publisher's
> intellectual
> > property.
> > > Bold may be that or
> > > >>it
> > > >>may be a way to imitate some of the font
> and
> > > kerning variations of a
> > > >>print
> > > >>book as a reading aid for sighted
> readers.
> > > >>
> > > >>This is sort of the flip side of the
> > conversation
> > > we had recently when
> > > >>you
> > > >>asked me not to announce a change in the
> > manual.
> > > >>
> > > >>scott
> > > >>
> > > >>On 5/21/11 12:27 PM, "Mayrie ReNae"
> <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
> > > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> >Hi Charisma,
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Oh, boy. I'm going to copy a section
> on
> > > the ellipsis that is our
> > > >>standard
> > > >> >for handling them so that they
> represent
> > > properly in braille. This is
> > > >>what
> > > >> >Bookshare would like you to do,
> please.
> > I'll
> > > paste it below my
> > > >>signature.
> > > >> >And then I'll save a copy for
> myself,
> > because
> > > it's going to be a pain
> > > >>in
> > > >> >the
> > > >> >neck to copy here from the braille
> book
> > that I
> > > have it in that tells
> > > >>how
> > > >> >to
> > > >> >format braille properly. Tell me
> that
> > > you love me, because I have to
> > > >>read
> > > >> >with two hands, remember enough to
> type,
> > type
> > > it and go back and read
> > > >>some
> > > >> >more. But all of your questions
> about
> > > how to handle the ellipsis will
> > > >>be
> > > >> >answered!
> > > >> >
> > > >> >As for bold, it does not denote
> headings,
> > the
> > > enlarged size
> > > >> >Of the font does that. The bolding
> is
> > > helpful, and we like it, but it
> > > >> >isn't
> > > >> >required. So you needn't go back and
> fix
> > them
> > > if you don't want to.
> > > >> >Bookshare does not require that you
> keep
> > > either bold or italics. That
> > > >> >said,
> > > >> >as a reader yourself, with the
> ability
> > to
> > > perceive italics, would you
> > > >> >personally prefer to have it in
> there?
> > > Many do, some people don't
> > > >>care.
> > > >> >My
> > > >> >advice, leave what you've done be
> for
> > this
> > > book, call it a learning
> > > >> >experience, and don't remove the
> italics
> > in
> > > future books. Torture is
> > > >>not
> > > >> >the name of the game here, and I
> know
> > that
> > > there are lots of books from
> > > >> >which italics have been removed by
> folks
> > who
> > > didn't know they mattered.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Okay, I'm going to paste/type below
> the
> > > information on how to properly
> > > >> >handle the ellipsis.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Mayrie
> > > >> >
> > > >> >The ellipsis should be punctuated as
> if
> > it
> > > were a word. Examples:
> > > >> >"Fools rush in ..."
> > > >> >
> > > >> >"... for they shall inherit the
> earth"
> > > >> > "Breathe, Mellissa. In ... and out.
> In
> > ...
> > > >> >and out."
> > > >> >An ellipsis and a period. Sometimes
> an
> > > ellipsis appears to be four
> > > >>dots
> > > >> >rather than three. This is because
> the
> > > ellipsis is either preceded or
> > > >> >followed by a period. Since the
> braille
> > period
> > > is not the same as the
> > > >>dots
> > > >> >of an ellipsis, it must be
> determined
> > which of
> > > the four dots is the
> > > >> >period.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >If the sentence is incomplete, does
> not
> > > contain a subject and a verb
> > > >>and
> > > >> >express a complete thought, then
> the
> > ellipsis
> > > is taking the place of
> > > >> >missing
> > > >> >words within the sentence--in which
> the
> > period
> > > immediately follows the
> > > >> >ellipsis, just as it would a word.
> If a
> > > sentence is gramatically
> > > >>complete,
> > > >> >the first dot represents the period
> and
> > the
> > > ellipsis represents a
> > > >> >following
> > > >> >missing sentence or sentences. In
> this
> > case a
> > > blank cell (a space) is
> > > >>left
> > > >> >between the period and the
> following
> > > ellipsis.
> > > >> >Example:
> > > >> >As you can see, I have followed
> your
> > career.
> > > ... As to my own ....
> > > >>Well,
> > > >> >you
> > > >> >know the story.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >-----Original Message-----
> > > >> >From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >> >[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > On Behalf Of Charisma
> > > >> >Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2011 11:24
> AM
> > > >> >To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >> >Subject: [bksvol-discuss] bolds,
> > italics,
> > > ellipses
> > > >> >
> > > >> >In the book I just scanned, from
> which I
> > > erroneously erased all italics
> > > >> >and
> > > >> >bolds, the bolds were found in the
> > glossary,
> > > for each new word.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Ought I to have left those bolds? I
> > thought
> > > anything that was in bold
> > > >> >indicated to the converter that that
> was
> > a
> > > heading? Of course, in this
> > > >> >case,
> > > >> >perhaps each new word in the
> glossary
> > ought to
> > > be it's own heading? I
> > > >> >already had the beginning of the
> Glossary
> > at
> > > font point 16.
> > > >> >I wonder now if I ought to have made
> each
> > word
> > > in the glossary font
> > > >>point
> > > >> >14, each word a subheading.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >OK, and since I erased every last
> italic
> > in
> > > this 255+ page book, ought
> > > >>I
> > > >> >to
> > > >> >go back and replace them all? I
> will
> > because I
> > > want the book to be
> > > >>perfect
> > > >> >but do I NEED to? (can you guess how
> I
> > am
> > > hoping? lol)
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Finally, ellipses. I have a
> question
> > > about your experiences. All
> > > >>ellipses
> > > >> >in these examples are three dots,
> not
> > spaces
> > > between them. On my Victor
> > > >> >Reader Stream, Set-up #1 If there is
> a
> > > word, then an ellipsis right up
> > > >> >against it, then a space, then the
> next
> > word,
> > > it reads fine; I never
> > > >>know
> > > >> >there is an ellipsis there.
> > > >> >Set-up #2 If there is a word, then
> a
> > space,
> > > then the ellipsis, then a
> > > >> >space,
> > > >> >then the next word, I hear" dot dot
> > dot".
> > > >> >Set-up #3 If there is a word and
> either
> > a
> > > space or no space, then an
> > > >> >ellipsis then no space then the
> next
> > word, if
> > > that next word has an
> > > >> >apostrophe it will not read
> properly.
> > That is,
> > > if the ellipsis pushes
> > > >>up
> > > >> >against the word God's (like this
> > ",,,God's"),
> > > my reader will read
> > > >>that as
> > > >> >"dot dot dot God s"
> > > >> >
> > > >> >I cannot remember which book it was
> that
> > was
> > > doing this so I can't
> > > >> >doublecheck it in Victor Reader Soft
> but
> > I am
> > > pretty sure these
> > > >>problems
> > > >> >are
> > > >> >the same in there.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >My TextAloud does not care as far as
> #3
> > > goes--it does not neglect
> > > >> >apostrophes.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Also, hate hate hate four dot
> ellipses.
> > Period
> > > OR ellipsis, author
> > > >>people,
> > > >> >not period AND ellipsis. I made an
> > executive
> > > decision and made half 4
> > > >>dot
> > > >> >and half 3 dot int eh 255+ page book
> I
> > just
> > > did. Which shall I fix?
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Charisma
> > > >> > To unsubscribe from this list send
> a
> > blank
> > > Email to
> > > >> >bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >> >put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself
> in
> > the
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> > > >> >of
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> > > >> >
> > > >> > To unsubscribe from this list send
> a
> > blank
> > > Email to
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> > > >> >put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself
> in
> > the
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> > > >>list
> > > >> >of available commands, put the word
> > 'help' by
> > > itself in the subject
> > > >>line.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > >
> >
> >>¢éì¹»®&Þ~º&¶¬Â+-±éÃ
> i¹ZžA&j)m¡¹,¾‰]Å
> >
> >>Ç.²Êު笵úÞzX¬¶Ê+‚›Â¶°¢·nžË›±ÊâmæòÅ
> > >>Û•ø
> > >
> > >>§¶¬¹¸ÞrÙb äèÂ
> ëZÂ+-¡ö¯j)ZnWϢiÅ¡Â
> Û)ºÛa{
> > >
> >
> >>+v¥¥¼¢¶Ç¥~)Ã…ë.n7ϦX§
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >
> > >
> > > >mailto:<the.bee@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > >--
> > > >
> > > >Enjoy what you have rather than desiring what
> you
> > don't
> > > have. Just
> > > >dreaming
> > > >about nice things is meaningless; it is like
> > chasing
> > > the
> > > >wind.--Ecclesiastes 6:9 NLT
> > > >
> > > > To unsubscribe from this list send a blank
> Email
> > to
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> > > >put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the
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> > > >of available commands, put the word 'help'
> by
> > itself in
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> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> N‹§²æìr¸›yúèšØb²X¬¶Ç§u¦åjy™¨¥¶†ä²ú%v+ºË+z«ž²×ëyéb²Û(®
> > >
> >
> n¶Ø^Šݺ{.nÇ+‰·›Ê+lzWâžØ^²æãyËeŠw“¢jX¬¶‡Ú½¨¥i¹^r‰¦jwl¦ëm…ì(Ø^––òŠÛ•ø
> > §¶¬¹¸ÞrÙb To unsubscribe from this list
> send a blank Email to
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> > put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the subject
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> >
> >
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To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to
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