[bksvol-discuss] Re: Table Of Contents
- From: "Kim Friedman" <kimfri11@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 17:29:38 -0800
Hi, Lynn, I think I agree with you when you're talking about using columns
on a Braille display. I think they are more easy to deal with when one has a
hard copy of a book in front of one. One can compare and contrast things
when one has a whole page of Braille to deal with rather than with just one
line. Regards, Kim.
_____
From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Lynn I
Sent: Thursday, November 05, 2009 11:11 AM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Table Of Contents
It's really too bad, but putting things in columns is very difficult for the
Braille reader, even though it's much easier for the print reader.
Columns are often split up in Braille, and depending on how many cells one
has on their Braille display, there is no way to do general column breaks
that will work for the various Braille displays. Many and the deaf/blind
community use their Braille displays exclusively. *smile*
Blessings.
Lynnsky
----- Original Message -----
From: Rogerbailey81@xxxxxxx
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, November 05, 2009 9:34 AM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Table Of Contents
It is those exact columns, though, that allow a sighted person to take in
the information in a single glance rather than having to think about it.
"I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth, and I am a citizen
of the world." Eugene V. Debs
The Militant: http://www.themilitant.com
<http://wwww.themilitant.com> Pathfinder Press:
http://www.pathfinderpress.com
Granma International: http://www.granma.cu/ingles/index.html
<http://granma.cu/ingles/index.html>
_
table with 2 columns and 6 rows
Subj:
[bksvol-discuss] Re: Table Of Contents
Date:
11/5/2009 12:57:49 AM Eastern Standard Time
From:
mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx
Reply-to:
bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To:
bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent from the Internet
(Details)
table end
Hi Debby,
I think the concensus is that we are now going to use a single elipsis
instead of using the dot leader format to separate chapter headings from
their respective page numbers in tables of contents. Valerie and Judy have
said that an elipsis is better than just a space. And in my opinion is more
practical than the dot leader format. Using all of those dots will be a
nightmare for users of screen readers. And creating exact columns like
you're talking about will be nightmarish too.
Mayrie
-----Original Message-----
From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Debby Franson
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2009 9:51 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Table Of Contents
Hi Judy S.!
How would I best go about putting enough periods in the table of contents?
Should I right justify the page numbers in the table of contents and then
fill in the periods, or what?
Debby
At 03:41 PM 11/4/2009, Judy s. wrote
>I agree with Valerie. It is a torture to figure out tables of contents
>visually with just the single space. I'm perfectly happy with an
>ellipsis instead of the space, as an idea. I can't see any way that
>trying to figuour out how many periods to put in to make the right
>margin on each line, as is done with a printed book, will make sense or
>be anything but a nightmare to do if you're blind. Having an ellipsis
>in makes it perfectly readable for me visually.
>
>Golly, I hope I'm making sense. I had some major dental surgery today
>and we had to use enough anesthesia to bring an elephant down. So I'm
>a bit loopy! grin.
>
>Judy s.
>
>Valerie Maples wrote:
>>Ideally you should have enough periods so the right margin is even for
>>visual scanning of page numbers as a list, but an ellipsis would be
>>better than a single space. that is outright torture to find anything.
>>Valerie
>>
>>On 11 04, 2009, at 11:17 AM, Mayrie ReNae wrote:
>>
>>>Hi Debby,
>>>
>>>I'd like more commentary from our sighted print disabled readers to
>>>know whether this will be helpful before I change my practises. I'm
>>>happy to change, as you are, but not willing to make a permanent
>>>change until or unless it is commented upon by more than one person.
>>>
>>>Vallerie, Doug, Judy, anyone else who is print disabled, but sighted
>>>want to comment on this?
>>>
>>>Mayrie
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Debby
>>>Franson
>>>Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2009 8:58 AM
>>>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Table Of Contents
>>>
>>>Hi Mayrie!
>>>
>>>Should I insert elipses in the table of contents in "Rebel With a Cause"?
>>>It wouldn't be a bother.
>>>
>>>Debby
>>>
>>>At 07:50 AM 11/3/2009, Mayrie ReNae wrote
>>>>Hi Melissa,
>>>>
>>>>That's a great idea! Let's see if it would work for folks like
>>>>Valerie's Nichole, since Valerie was the one requesting a change.
>>>>If it would work, I don't see how it would go against anything
>>>>bookshare has
>>>ever said.
>>>>
>>>>Mayrie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Melissa
>>>>Smith
>>>>Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 5:07 AM
>>>>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Table Of Contents
>>>>
>>>>I've been thinking about Valerye's concerns about the table of contents.
>>>>I got to thinking about how Braille books have a series of dots
>>>>between the chapter title and page number. So, I was wondering if
>>>>inserting an ellipses between the chapter title and page number
>>>>would be an appropriate
>>>solution.
>>>>An ellipses will be recognized and kept by bookshare's tools, and
>>>>will give some separation between chapter title and page number for
>>>>those that need that. It wouldn't be spoken by most screen readers,
>>>>so wouldn't interfere with anybody's listening pleasure.
>>>>Finally, since Braille readers are used to the series of dots
>>>>between chapter title and page number, it wouldn't seem unusual to them
either.
>>>>So, do you think this would be acceptable and not violate any
>>>>bookshare rules?
>>>>
>>>>Melissa
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>--
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line.
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--
Enjoy what you have rather than desiring what you don't have. Just dreaming
about nice things is meaningless; it is like chasing the wind.--Ecclesiastes
6:9 NLT
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