atw: Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)
- From: BOG4N <bog4n@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <austechwriter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 13:57:05 +1030
Oh Christine, you really are struggling with the whole concept, aren't you?!
Maybe you should stick with your quill and scroles, deary.
You're absolutely tripping if you think FB isn't about communication. Have you
actually spent any time with the application? ...because it sounds to me that
you haven't.
Like Charles, I also use FB as a means of communication with my OS firends in
much the same way I use email.
Admittedly, FB is a pretty crappy and limited tool, but it still serves its
intended purpose and that is to help connect ppl and facilitae communication
between you and your contacts.
There is much more to FB than a person's "I-centerd" profile.
B0G4N> From: christine_kent@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: austechwriter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: atw: Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)> Date:
Tue, 15 Apr 2008 13:11:49 +1000> > Ning is the grown-up facebook - if that is
not a contradiction in terms.> > I told you I was struggling with the language
to communicate the concepts.> So please understand that I am not broadcasting
at you from a point of> certainty, but attempting to collaborate in a
discussion to bring light on a> relatively unformulated feeling that I am (and
incidentally many grown-ups> on Ning are) grappling with.> > For a start, I
think we differ on the meaning of the words "communication"> and "structure".>
> Communication to me has to involve some kind of heart space, some kind of>
loaded meaning in every word and/or some kind of change of state as a result>
of the communication. I think you are using it to mean telling people about>
you, and listening to stories others are telling about themselves. For you> it
is an exchange of stories, for me it results in a changed state of being.> >
Structure to me is more than boxes. If I have a box of post-it notes, and a>
box of illustrations - that is a degree of structure - everything is in> boxes.
But there is no relationship between each of the items in each box,> and no
relationship between the boxes. So perhaps I am really talking about>
relationships.> > I think your comment, "pages... are constructed by a user
specifically to> reflect that user's interests and> network connections" does
support my point about I-centred communication -> everyone is telling their own
story of "I".> > Your comment, "we must be aware though of the distinction
between the> capability of the application and its presumed limitations (being
subjective> to each user's imagination)" may or may not be true. If you look
at> LearningTown (http://learningtown.ning.com/) and ContentWrangler>
(http://thecontentwrangler.ning.com/ ), you will see really good topics> dying
without reaching any outcome or conclusion - they run out of energy> and do not
bring about any changed state. I am part of several other groups> on Ning,
trying to make it do what we want it to do - so far without much> joy.> > I
would hate to see these mailing lists all get gobbled up into Ning,> because
they can do what Ning can't.> > Christine> > > -----Original Message----->
From: austechwriter-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:austechwriter-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Charles Lidgard> Sent:
Tuesday, 15 April 2008 12:15 PM> To: austechwriter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: atw:
Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)> > In response to
Christine Kent's recent comments on Facebook.> > > "The first key difference
with the networking sites such as Face Book and> Ning, is that there is little
attempt at structure - they are random pages> of information with lateral links
to unrelated pages of information -> veryfrustrating for a brain trained to
think logically and sequentially."> > > > I am not sure I understand your point
here. I'm not familiar with Ning at> all but use Facebook regularly - what is
it about Facebook's structure that> is not logical? Part of Facebook's appeal
is that each page is structured in> a similar way - which was a departure at
the time from MySpace, which> allowed for direct editing of the HTML/CSS. The
pages of information> (presume you mean third party apps and the standard
information shown on> each profile page) are anything but random when you
consider they are> constructed by a user specifically to reflect that user's
interests and> network connections. The links are related therefore to that
user's> interests. > > > > "They cater to two activities only, passive
observation, and I-centred> self-expression. They have nothing whatever to do
with communication."> > > > I totally disagree. It is my opinion that Facebook
is a useful networking> tool and an innovative centralised means of keeping in
contact and> communicating with friends/acquaintances. For example, I use
Facebook as the> sole means of communication with several friends overseas. How
you use> Facebook is up to you - we must be aware though of the distinction
between> the capability of the application and its presumed limitations (being>
subjective to each user's imagination).> > > > > > -----Original Message----->
From: austechwriter-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:austechwriter-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Christine Kent> Sent:
Tuesday, 15 April 2008 10:19 AM> To: austechwriter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: atw:
Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)> > > > I have no answers
to any of this because I think the situation is much> > broader than just the
use of letters in words. It is about the> > communication process overall. I am
writing a course on email that includes> > a heading "Collaboration" and
mentions FaceBook - in other words, the> > designer has no idea what either is
about. And nor did I till I started> > exploration.> > > > I found there are
two classes of Web 2.0 site out there that get mixed -> > collaboration sites
and networking sites, with some crossover between the> > two. > > > > The first
key difference with the networking sites such as Face Book and> > Ning, is that
there is little attempt at structure - they are random pages> > of information
with lateral links to unrelated pages of information - very> > frustrating for
a brain trained to think logically and sequentially. They> > cater to two
activities only, passive observation, and I-centred> > self-expression. They
have nothing whatever to do with communication.> > There is no responsibility
on the part of the writer to write in a way that> > is heard, and no
responsibility on the part of the reader to provide> > feedback or in any way
react to what they have read. So the purpose for> > writing has changed from
communication to self-expression.> > > > There is a concept of inviting someone
to be your friend, and the idea seems> > to be to collect as many "friends" as
possible. This means that the meaning> > of the word friend has changed to mean
acquaintance. That is just one> > example of the conceptual substance of a word
changing as a result of the> > new technology.> > > > Another word that
confused me was "collaboration". I thought it meant people> > interacting in a
way that changes what each does as a result of input from> > others. When it is
used in the networking space, it doesn't. A Wiki is> > apparently
collaborative. In other words, if lots of individuals add lots> > of individual
entries into a common space, that is collaboration. Maybe my> > meaning was
wrong - or maybe the meaning has changed. Again, it has lost> > the element of
communication. It has become a collection of I-centred> > self-expression.> > >
> However, when you look at collaborative sites such as Google Docs, Office> >
Live and Windows Live, collaboration does still mean collaboration the way I> >
define it. It is still about sharing documents and doing whatever you do> >
with them together. These are currently designed for grown-ups. > > > > I
speculate that as the current "texting" generation progresses through> > life,
they will take their new meanings for old words with them. They will> > also
take their "communication" processes with them - which means that the> > whole
process of communication as we understand it - the inter-relationship> > of two
or more people that changes each - will be a lost concept. They will> > also be
masters of lateral non-sequential thought, and the logical> > analytical
process that is necessary for structuring information will be the> > preserve
of the few.> > > > My own analysis is all over the place at present, because
this whole field> > of exploration is new to me and I am "un-learned" - ie, I
don't have the> > language I need to make it make sense - a great example of
the importance of> > sophisticated language in the process of gaining and
communicating> > intellectual clarity.> > > > Christine> > > >
...................................> > > > Hi Everyone!> > > > > > Great Mate
vs Gr8 M8> > > > > > > > What is the difference between the two and why should
one set of symbols> > render the other as useless when in fact they are still
the same in> > pronunciation and meaning and in fact nothing has really changed
or has> > it? Has the meaning been diminished in any way? ..............> > > >
> > > > No virus found in this outgoing message.> > Checked by AVG. > >
Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.22.13/1377 - Release Date: 14/04/2008> >
9:26 AM> > > > > > **************************************************> > To
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- Follow-Ups:
- atw: Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)
- From: Christine Kent
- References:
- atw: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8
- From: Nikki Ward
- atw: Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)
- From: Christine Kent
- atw: Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)
- From: Charles Lidgard
- atw: Re: Great Mate vs Gr8 M8 (very long and philosophical)
- From: Christine
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