[atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
- From: Allen Welty-Green <agmedia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: atlantaprog@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 15:05:03 -0500
Time to put on my moderator hat...
While I enjoy eavesdropping on other band's dirty laundry as much as anyone, I would respectfully request that any further exchanges of this nature between former Lord Only members take place off-list. Thanks!
AWG
On Mar 29, 2005, at 12:04 PM, BK Broyla wrote:
John,
I was hoping that when you resurfaced, it would be to announce the completion of the second Lord Only cd mixdown that we "shackled" you with THREE YEARS AGO. Instead, you come here to sling shit across the cage like a chimp at the zoo. Hal and I have enough dirt on you to make you look like the village idiot, but you know what? We're having too much fun working on the new band's album to care. Thanks for the best laugh I've had all year-- this gem is getting framed!
Brian
john <7strbass@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
great topic phil! i'd like to add some random thoughts - haven't posted much here in a while since lord only broke up, so howdy
everyone :-).
i'd like to add that people rarely change. trust your first impressions implicity, and don't have expectations from a person that
run counter to their obvious nature. remember the frog and the scorpion. people are what they are, and they are not going to
change for you or for your "killer band".
this not only goes for their personalities, but it also goes for their playing - if they suck when you meet them, don't expect them
to get better. after all, why should they? they've got the gig already. shoot for playing with folks that are better than you,
this way you will improve.
like phil said, you also need to find people who respect you, both as a person and for what your own personal musical visio n is.
someone with the inability to do this is going to be a net loss to work with, both on the project as a whole and on one's own
spirit.
they also need to have respect for what they themselves are trying to do as well (i.e. folks who practice and prepare properly for
performances or rehearsals beforehand, have quality -working- gear that's in good condition, etc.). otherwise their lack of focus
and commitment can be contagious and you can end up looking like donuts on stage.
beware of folks who's nature's dictate that they have to blame someone else for every thing bad that happens - not only is this
indicative of a complete lack of respect for their cohorts but it also indicates a total lack of maturity and responsibility. folks
like that are hard to get along with since they force others around them to coddle them, and are never satisfied, regardless of
accomplishments. further, they tend to be willing to do very little to improve the situation or fix the problem since, after all,
it's not their fault anyway, is it? notice, though, that the responsibility for the accomplishments and successes will then have to
be shared - that's when these kinds of folks are willing to take the responsibility- when there's accolades to be had.
run the other way.
about the control-freak comment - if you feel like you are required to be a control freak (and to therefore assume much more of
the responsibility for the project's success or failure than is your due) to accomplish anything, because of your bandmates'
unwillingness or inability to take responsibility for more than just the bare minimum of their own personal bandly duties then you
are playing with the wrong people. bail now.
that's not to say that being a benign dictator is a bad thing, it has worked for a lot of musicians in the past. just make sure the
musicians you are playing with understand and agree with the fact that that's the way things are. if the band starts out as an
equal partnership and then one person starts getting shackled with all the work, and gets blamed for all the failures, that's a bad
situation.
on phil's point about communication, i'd only like to expound on this one by saying that there's a huge difference between
communication and gossiping. nothing can ruin a friendship or a band quicker than mary whining to peter about paul. paul's going
to end up hating both of them. again it goes back to responsibility and maturity. it takes a lot of maturity to look someone in
the eye and say, calmly, "i don't like what you're doing and this is why, so what can we do together to rectify this?". it's common
in the workplace, but it's almost unheard of in bands.
on the point about having a life...
professional musicians live their music, as much as anyone lives their job. i don't see what's "scary" about that.
i'd rather work with a 2 dimensional musician-only kind of person than someone who's idea of extracurricular activities involve
something with potentially detrimental effects in the long term to themselves and to you by proxy.
here too, be sure to look for people who are serious about what they are doing, and put the music -first-, not as just one of many
activities, when its time to do the music. folks who come to rehearsal ready to bullshit about politics or religion or some other
useless topic don't have the right priorities and aren't going to accomplish much. it's either a band or a social club. i haven't
heard of too many social clubs that gig successfully.
the folks that i've been working with lately are pros, and it's been both exhilerating and challenging to adjust to their level.
they are friends, sure - we get along great, we have a good amount of stuff in common, and we have a great respect for each other's
differences, but the reason we work togethe r is to make music. it's not a priority that we all agreed to have, it was something
that was there before we even met each other. the genetic imperative to make music is what drew us together. that's the kind of
people i want to work with.
there has to be that commitment there or else it will never rise above the level of stamp collecting, imo. it's the difference
between a group of drinking buddies getting together every sunday to watch the game and the team on the field. the drinking buddies
may go out and toss the football sometimes, and the guys on the team may watch sports together, but the difference lies in the
priorities.
________________________________
john turner - Atlanta, GA
Endorsements : Conklin Guitars, SIT Strings
Check out http://www.talkbass.com
Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page
- References:
- [atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
- From: BK Broyla
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- » [atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
- » [atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
- » [atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
- » [atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
I was hoping that when you resurfaced, it would be to announce the completion of the second Lord Only cd mixdown that we "shackled" you with THREE YEARS AGO. Instead, you come here to sling shit across the cage like a chimp at the zoo. Hal and I have enough dirt on you to make you look like the village idiot, but you know what? We're having too much fun working on the new band's album to care. Thanks for the best laugh I've had all year-- this gem is getting framed!
Brian
john <7strbass@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
great topic phil! i'd like to add some random thoughts - haven't posted much here in a while since lord only broke up, so howdy
everyone :-).
i'd like to add that people rarely change. trust your first impressions implicity, and don't have expectations from a person that
run counter to their obvious nature. remember the frog and the scorpion. people are what they are, and they are not going to
change for you or for your "killer band".
this not only goes for their personalities, but it also goes for their playing - if they suck when you meet them, don't expect them
to get better. after all, why should they? they've got the gig already. shoot for playing with folks that are better than you,
this way you will improve.
like phil said, you also need to find people who respect you, both as a person and for what your own personal musical visio n is.
someone with the inability to do this is going to be a net loss to work with, both on the project as a whole and on one's own
spirit.
they also need to have respect for what they themselves are trying to do as well (i.e. folks who practice and prepare properly for
performances or rehearsals beforehand, have quality -working- gear that's in good condition, etc.). otherwise their lack of focus
and commitment can be contagious and you can end up looking like donuts on stage.
beware of folks who's nature's dictate that they have to blame someone else for every thing bad that happens - not only is this
indicative of a complete lack of respect for their cohorts but it also indicates a total lack of maturity and responsibility. folks
like that are hard to get along with since they force others around them to coddle them, and are never satisfied, regardless of
accomplishments. further, they tend to be willing to do very little to improve the situation or fix the problem since, after all,
it's not their fault anyway, is it? notice, though, that the responsibility for the accomplishments and successes will then have to
be shared - that's when these kinds of folks are willing to take the responsibility- when there's accolades to be had.
run the other way.
about the control-freak comment - if you feel like you are required to be a control freak (and to therefore assume much more of
the responsibility for the project's success or failure than is your due) to accomplish anything, because of your bandmates'
unwillingness or inability to take responsibility for more than just the bare minimum of their own personal bandly duties then you
are playing with the wrong people. bail now.
that's not to say that being a benign dictator is a bad thing, it has worked for a lot of musicians in the past. just make sure the
musicians you are playing with understand and agree with the fact that that's the way things are. if the band starts out as an
equal partnership and then one person starts getting shackled with all the work, and gets blamed for all the failures, that's a bad
situation.
on phil's point about communication, i'd only like to expound on this one by saying that there's a huge difference between
communication and gossiping. nothing can ruin a friendship or a band quicker than mary whining to peter about paul. paul's going
to end up hating both of them. again it goes back to responsibility and maturity. it takes a lot of maturity to look someone in
the eye and say, calmly, "i don't like what you're doing and this is why, so what can we do together to rectify this?". it's common
in the workplace, but it's almost unheard of in bands.
on the point about having a life...
professional musicians live their music, as much as anyone lives their job. i don't see what's "scary" about that.
i'd rather work with a 2 dimensional musician-only kind of person than someone who's idea of extracurricular activities involve
something with potentially detrimental effects in the long term to themselves and to you by proxy.
here too, be sure to look for people who are serious about what they are doing, and put the music -first-, not as just one of many
activities, when its time to do the music. folks who come to rehearsal ready to bullshit about politics or religion or some other
useless topic don't have the right priorities and aren't going to accomplish much. it's either a band or a social club. i haven't
heard of too many social clubs that gig successfully.
the folks that i've been working with lately are pros, and it's been both exhilerating and challenging to adjust to their level.
they are friends, sure - we get along great, we have a good amount of stuff in common, and we have a great respect for each other's
differences, but the reason we work togethe r is to make music. it's not a priority that we all agreed to have, it was something
that was there before we even met each other. the genetic imperative to make music is what drew us together. that's the kind of
people i want to work with.
there has to be that commitment there or else it will never rise above the level of stamp collecting, imo. it's the difference
between a group of drinking buddies getting together every sunday to watch the game and the team on the field. the drinking buddies
may go out and toss the football sometimes, and the guys on the team may watch sports together, but the difference lies in the
priorities.
________________________________
john turner - Atlanta, GA
Endorsements : Conklin Guitars, SIT Strings
Check out http://www.talkbass.com
Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page
- [atlantaprog] Re: John Turner Overdrive
- From: BK Broyla