[access-uk] Re: Google is more accessible from today
- From: "Graham Page" <gpage@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 00:33:56 -0000
Hi Ray. I am interested to hear you find the BBC site accessible. I find it
fairly inaccessible because things like headings are often not used well so
there is no easy way of moving from one part of the site to another. However,
because there are so many ways of nnavigating any site it may well be that I am
missing something obvious.If you go to a radio program, say Up All Night on
radio 5 live, how do you quickly get to the part of the site you want?
Regards
graham
----- Original Message -----
From: Ray's Home
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2006 11:34 PM
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Google is more accessible from today
Adrian, please do not get the impression that I'm suggesting the mere
inclusion of headings alone is somehow a magic bullet which will dramatically
improve access or usability of web pages. No, I'm only saying - as have quite
a few here - that it has improved the usefulness of the Googleresults page.
I'm not a committee person, and nor am I involved in web development, but I
would say the more web developers get to know about how screen readers can use
the various elements available for web page design, the more likely it might be
they will use these in their designs so that the the navigability of a site can
be better and its appearance still be good too. After all, isn't this what
Tink and others are trying to do?
Amongst the sites I'd say are good to use for me are the Beeb, in general;
my bank's internet banking site, and Spamjab, which fortunately, I don't have
to use so much now. In all cases it is due to elements such as headings,
forms, combo boxes and more being used propperly.
A not so good site, but not 'inaccessable' is Sound On Sound. there I find
that the start of a product review doesn't have a heading, in fact the review
pages don't have headings at all, but I would have thought a heading would
certainly be appropriate in such a position. Still, not all is lost. I know
that by searching for 'reviews' I land where I want to be.
So, I restate, apart from the design and coding of web pages, we must learn
to drive our screen readers properly too.
I am not at all sure how much committees can publish general guidelines and
lay down standards that are readily understood by many web developers. I
suppose though they have to try and do just that.
From Ray
I can be contacted off-list at:
mailto:ray-48@xxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of
Graham Page
Sent: 16 November 2006 7:23PM
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Google is more accessible from today
supernova does as well as does IBM homepage reader though this is not
really a screenreader. I believe System Access does as well.
Regards
Graham
----- Original Message -----
From: Adrian Higginbotham
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2006 4:43 PM
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Google is more accessible from today
Good to hear that it is more than just one product that support
navigation by heading, can anyone advance on JFW and W_E? of course if more
sites like Google implement structural mark-up then other assistive technology
venders may follow suit and this would be a positive thing. What worries me
about the Search results as Headings as implemented by Google is not so much
that they have done it, afterall so many people have already said how helpful
it is, and I am indeed finding it is making my own life much easier, but rather
that the Web development community at large may latch on to the idea that in
order to make your Website accessible to screenreader users you should mark-up
important information in an #h' tag. of course I might be too sinical and
actually Google are leading the world in using structural mark-up something
which many of us have been campaigning for for a long long time and not just on
the Web. here's hoping that every document author follows their example. Let
us however stay on their case and make sure that such a useful tag is used
appropriately otherwise it will sease to be effective. My concerns are in the
main based on some work I did with a consultant a year or so ago who had used a
screenreader user to test some of their work. He had watched the individual
navigating the Web for a while and concluded that in the main he did not use
site navigation but rather tended to read content and follow links from there
in, often following a very round about route to reach his destination. His
particular solution to this was to enhance the access support in the content
(good news) but to let loose with the role-over drop down menus and other
javascript dependant objects within navigation structures purely because his
experience was that this would have little impact. Yes that was one developer
and one insidence but it does demonstrate the power behind messages such as
"thanks for putting headers on every paragraph". developers like the rest of
us look for easy solutions to difficult problems and I do feel that as a
community we need to be cautious about over simplifying what are lets be honest
complex issues.
Similar examples are evident as far back as the early days of the WAI
guidance, particular ones which spring to mind are the RNIB advocating the use
of the star symbol (*) as an alt tag for esthetic images rather than a null
value. Viewing this on a scree in a training room the star looked rather like
a letter "x" and for a year or two there was a spat of UK Websites with
sporadic xs' here and there for no obvious reason.
So yes lets offer praise where praise is due but lets also temper it with
a reminder that there is more work still to be done - has anyone for example
had cause to use the Google audio capchure feature lately - excellent that they
found a work around for the visual only capchure but I'm not sure that the
numbers spoken over a garbled background noise is satisfactory, has anyone with
hearing loss tried to use this ?
Adrian Higginbotham
Project manager, Standards
British Educational Communications and Technology Agency - BECTA
Tel: Direct dial 024 7679 7333 - Becta switchboard 02476-416994.
Email: Adrian.Higginbotham@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Web: http://www.becta.org.uk/
BECTA, Millburn Hill Road, Science Park, Coventry, CV4 7JJ
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