[access-uk] Re: Fw: Disabled People and Chip and Pin

I would agree totally that the ATM is the main problem.  If you have to have 
sighted assistance to put in your PIN  number, this means that in all 
probability the person assisting you is going to see you putting the number 
into the system.  While this may not do any harm, since the card is, at least 
hopefully always going to be in your possession, we are advised by the Banks 
and Building Societies not to let anyone, even Bank Staff know what this number 
is.  An audio guide of what is on the screen and which buttons should be 
pressed to perform which function would probably be a good deal better for all 
blind/vi people using ATMs. 

Tony

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Iain Lackie
  To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2006 10:15 PM
  Subject: [access-uk] Re: Fw: Disabled People and Chip and Pin


  I Agree. It seems to me that when it comes to Chip and Pin, the DRC and the 
RNIB are fighting the wrong battle. If there is a fight to be fought, it is to 
make sure that keypads are standard. However, an accessible ATM machine would 
be much more worth fighting for.

  Iain.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Graham Page
    To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2006 9:51 PM
    Subject: [access-uk] Re: Fw: Disabled People and Chip and Pin


    I don't think speech would be that valuable here as the transaction is not 
that complicated.  Another old chessnut though is the talking cash machine 
which occasionally seems to get tried out but never catches on at all to my 
knowledge.  The difference here is that there is a keypad plus about 8 buttons, 
may be 10, arranged in colums either side of the screen.  The purpose of these 
buttons is different depending on the operation being carried out so it is 
necessary to either learn the sequence for the banks you want to use or ask 
someone for help, a risky business.

    It would be a shame therefore if the DRC and TUC concentrated on Chip and 
Pin where broadly speaking we have a good solution that just needs a bit of 
tinkering and ignored the issue of cash machines where there are really genuin 
access issues.

    Regards

    Graham
    Graham Page

    Mobile: 07753 607980
    Fax:  0870 706 2773
    Email: gpage@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    MSN: gabriel_mcbird@xxxxxxxxxxx
    Skype: gabriel_mcbird
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: James O'Dell
    To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2006 4:59 PM
    Subject: [access-uk] Re: Fw: Disabled People and Chip and Pin


    I agree with most of the points raised here, I often ask for help and have 
no problems, I was just trying to think of possible applications for speech in 
this situation - whether it is actually necessary or worth the effort is a 
different point altogether.

    James
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Ray's Home
      To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
      Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2006 4:25 PM
      Subject: [access-uk] Re: Fw: Disabled People and Chip and Pin


      We seem to be going all round the houses with this one, and we've done it 
before too!

      Tristram is right of course.  Human assistance, usually helpful is there 
at the cash point.  Don't be afraid or too proud to use it.

      On the question of devices communicating wirelessly with a very small 
device we carry around, ;  don't dismiss this idea too lightly.  I could 
forsee, or is it dream? of a device that could do this and more.  Why not 
something combining EPOS communication with electronic signage - if only this 
pathetic country could get its act together and enable us to identify things 
when out and about.  Maybe too it could be combined and work alongside Sat Nav. 
 Handheld Sat nav devices are already around I believe, and there's even been 
talk, (pub unintended) that a talking hand-held sat nav device might become 
available, I mean a truly hand held one, that is.  Dream on.
      Ray

      Personal emails:  Email me at
      mailto:ray-48@xxxxxxxx

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Tristram Llewellyn


        The cashier should be able to let you all of those things, including 
where to put the card which varies with different types of terminal as part of 
the transaction and do it better than any synthetic speech could.  They will 
let you know also if the PIN is entered incorrectly.

        Regards.

        Tristram Llewellyn



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