[access-uk] Re: Accessibilty and the iPad: First Impressions | ATMac
- From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 00:21:46 -0000
Hi James,
I don't hate Apple products for their lack of accessibility, I just dislike
them because they are technologically behind. The iPhone for example,
should nowadays be able to multitask. It should be able to connect to a
Bluetooth keyboard. It should have better battery life. Although the Mac
supports Braille, albeit only grade one, the iPhone doesn't support it at
all. Talks at least supports Braille so it gives deaf-blind users a chance.
I just think that while I agree with you that blind people are often
misinformed, also the marketing machine is working well. Blind and sighted
alike buy Apple products because they feel or look nice. They don't tend to
have much idea, nor necessarily should they, of the technical specs. The
iPhone again is an example of a pretty poorly specked phone, as compared to
some of the Nokia phones, and is also very expensive. I think Sim-free,
last time I looked, the iPhone is about 430 pounds. I could easily get a
phone, say the 6730, and add Talks for less than that. And so the blind are
sucked in by the fact that because the operating system is built in, it
makes the product plus accessibility, less expensive. This is by no means
the case.
Just my opinion.
All the best
Steve
From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
James & Nash
Sent: Saturday 30 January 2010 19:38
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Accessibilty and the iPad: First Impressions |
ATMac
Applause, applause, applause! Exactly, this is the benefit of having
mainstream products being made accessible to us. We can use the same
products as our sighted friends and co-workers etc, without the need to buy
over priced (and generally unworthy) Blindness products. That last comment
is a personal one aimed squarely at Freedom Scientific as I don't feel that
anything they've introduced since JAWS 7.0 has been worth paying for. Also,
using mainstream products means that we don't have to deal with the
questionable business practices of such companies. Yes, I know that Apple
too have some less than ethical practices - at least in my opinion, and that
the choice to use a proprietary operating system has drawbacks, but Windows
too is locked down. But the keyword there is "choice". All of you Windows AT
venders listen up - it seems the reason you guys are taking shots at Apple
is because you can see that if you were to become Apple re-sellers, you
wouldn't be making so much money from the very expensive products foisted
upon the Blind.
Also, let's take an example from here in Europe. JAWS 11 came out at the end
of last year, however in Central Europe in ooh let's say France for example,
JAWS 11 is still not available in French. This is disgraceful and FS should
be ashamed of themselves. Having fought with them for years over issues like
this as a foreign language user, I have come to the conclusion that they
really are not interested in providing the same level of accessibility to
all of their customers at the same time. And before anyone says anything, I
know that Apple do not provide French voices etc by default in Mac OS X
which is equally disgraceful on their part and again I've told them so -
especially when they are available on the IPhone. However, the fact that
they are there on the IPhone suggests that they might put them into Mac OS X
if they can get the licensing sorted out. There are voices though - and
although they are around 300 Euros, they are still more reasonably priced
than JFW which costs between 1300-1600 Euros. Whichever way you look at it,
the ability for us to use mainstream products opens up so many new avenues
for the Blind. Remember too, that all you are purchasing are the voices - VO
comes with the operating system. That said, Mac OS X does provide Grade 1
Braille (all be it English) allowing a Blind person to install the operating
system independently. Quite a few foreign language codes are available
though after installation, including French Grade 1. Grade 2 is proving a
bit more difficult to implement, but hopefully in time, the person doing
this should get it done.
Anyone interested in getting foreign language Braille codes for their mac on
this list can go to:
http://www.cecimac.org
This site is in French, but I think there is an English translation too.
I don't like ranting like this - and I'm sorry if this upsets the
moderators, but as i said in a previous message, Blind people have been
dreadfully misinformed and people should be given the opportunity to hear
"the truth" if they want to. I fully accept that there are those who are
happy with what they use and that is absolutely fine. i also know that there
are those people who just don't want to hear about alternatives and put
their heads' in the sand - that's ok too. This is just a personal view and
it is not meant to antagonise anyone.
TC
James, Lyn, Nash & Twinny
On 30 Jan 2010, at 18:09, Tony wrote:
Blind person visits apple shop.
Buys Mac, iPhone, iPod touch, in the future an iPad maybe, who knows what's
next?
Takes it home, switches it on, and begins using it.
No need for specialist software, or any further outlay of cash.
So, the assistive software may have its limitations, but hasn't the
assistive software used to access the Widnows operating system got its
limitations too?
Hats off to Steve Jobs, main stream products, accessibility built in, that
can't be bad surely.
From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Gordon Keen
Sent: 30 January 2010 15:53
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Accessibilty and the iPad: First Impressions |
ATMac
It's being so cheerful that keeps him going.
Cheers
G
From glorious Devon, England.
On 30 Jan 2010, at 12:20, James & Nash wrote:
Your distain disguised as sarcasm is really telling on your position Steve.
But I must agree with you, it's a little strange considering that Mac OS X
is built upon UNIX which is a true multi-user operating system. Unless of
course the IPhone doesn't run on top of UNIX. As I don't have an IPhone and
I've not intention of getting one, I am not really that interested in it.
TC
James Lyn, Nash & Twinny
On 29 Jan 2010, at 23:59, Steve Nutt wrote:
Hi Gordon,
I think the only real telling thing in that article is that you can only do
one thing at once. This means no multitasking. Just like the Touch or the
iPhone, you can't even turn Zoom and speech on at the same time. Turn one
on, and the other goes off. You can't leave Email being collected in the
background. You can't have a Twitter client running in the background or an
Instant Messenger.
A reall leap forward I must say.
All the best
Steve
From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Gordon Keen
Sent: Friday 29 January 2010 14:18
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [access-uk] Accessibilty and the iPad: First Impressions | ATMac
Steve Nutt, look away now :-)
.
Thought this might be of interest.
Cheers
G
From glorious Devon, England
http://atmac.org/accessibilty-and-the-ipad-first-impressions/
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