FreeLists / webproducers / [webproducers] Re: request for proposal

["Tim Slavin \(Red House Communications, LLC\)" <tim@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi,

Full disclosure: what I'm about to describe is a paid online service that I
built to help me manage my internet marketing clients. So if vendor pitches
offend you, feel free to hit the delete button.

First, I'm a long time listener and some time participant on this list
because I find it very useful to hear discussions of CMS tools and related
topics. People here always have at least one or two good links to consider
when trying to solve our common problems.

In this case, I've built and used CMS tools for I'm scared to say 12 years.
Specifically trying to put tools in the hands of average, highly
non-technical people who want a minimum of links to wade through. Over time,
though, I realized the problems I face as a solo web professional and my
clients face are a bit bigger than finding a great publishing tool. A number
of my clients have Contact Us pages, for example, and they need a simple but
centralized way to manage those leads. And, for myself, adding a new client
means keeping track of 4-7 new logins then digging them out when I have to
make changes. It's a mess.

Given all that, I've tried and failed to get clients to use Contribute,
WordPress, MoveableType, Joomla, Drupal, and so on. My clients tend to be
smaller and way too busy to figure out what "module" means, or "node", to
just publish a copy edit. These are great tools for people who have at least
slight technical expertise and/or companies with the funds to hire
professional staff. That doesn't describe my clients.

So in 2006 I hired a programmer and created an online service that tries to
avoid the worst problems of other publishing tools I've used. It also makes
it easy to change page titles, content titles, meta tags, breadcrumb
navigation, and other search optimization tweaks. It also publishes to your
server and uses your page designs. And I've designed the service so it's
easy to get out: your pages are on your server, your leads can be exported
to CSV, and logins can be printed out. (I hate vendor lock-in, mostly.)
Early last year I started adding my clients and, so far, it seems to work
well for them. It's not 100% perfect but it does solve the key problems my
clients have as well as my issues managing their projects. I've even made
small copy changes on vacation using my cell phone.

Katherine, I was interested in your list of requirements in that my service
has most everything except a file manager. That's coming later this year,
mostly because none of my clients have asked for it yet.

If anyone is interested, and still reading, here's the URL if you want to
explore:

http://www.redwrangler.com

The service is $14.95/month and includes about an hour of free setup
support, mostly to create the website connection using FTP info and creating
templates from existing pages. You get a free account, too, for your site
with one paid client subscription. The service is intended to be the last
step after you push a button to create the html pages, or have someone code
a design from PSD or jpeg files. My role is to help designers who then turn
around and provide the service to their clients and (hopefully) benefit from
managing their clients from one login.

Anyway, understanding this is not intended to be as extensive as Drupal or
similar open source tools, that it is meant only to solve basic problems
solo web professionals have with juggling multiple clients, I welcome any
feedback. Feel free to email me if you're interested enough to want a demo,
too.

At the least, thanks for an interesting discussion. I also have a few tools
to check out from this thread.

Tim

Tim Slavin
RedWrangler.com
tim@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx





 

-----Original Message-----
From: webproducers-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:webproducers-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Katherine Gray
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 1:31 PM
To: webproducers@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [webproducers] Re: request for proposal

That's great advice, Sharon. Thanks.=20

I asked a client who is currently using Drupal how she felt about it and she
was pretty negative. She felt it was clunky and unreliable compared to what
she used in the past (which was a custom CMS) and she was dependent on IT
when she had a problem, something you're usually what you're trying to avoid
with a CMS. I wonder if open-source sounds great to us because we can see
the configuration possibilities with something so flexible and easy to get
into cost-wise (and, BTW, I'm officially agnostic about open-source vs. uh,
non-open source). But when you put this in front of a busy marketing manager
it doesn't meet their needs of having something they don't have to think
about using but just do.

I haven't gone through all the links everyone has sent but I thank you in
advance. I've got leads to explore!

Regards,

Katherine

-----Original Message-----
From: webproducers-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:webproducers-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
sharongreenfield@xxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:22 AM
To: webproducers@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [webproducers] Re: request for proposal

Katherine, et al-

You know, I also find that a 'requirement' for a CMS solution, is =20 that
it's sustainable with the client, that is you can just leave it =20 and they
understand it and are happy.
So, sometimes I give them what I call 'testdrives'.

I have them run around the backend interface of Wordpress and Joomla, =20
(and now Drupal)etc.
This helps the client really see the realities of working day to day =20 in
the CMS.

Some are so scared of Wordpress after taking the testdrive, that I =20
realise implementing anything more complicated than that would just =20 be
malicious.
Or not, some really take to one interface or another. And then being =20
clear about the pros and cons and abilities of each compared with =20 their
requirements.
And then make the decision together.

It used to be, we would just code a site for the client, and they =20 would
be happy, but there was no CMS and tiny changes had to go =20 through us.
Now, with the idea of giving the client more control over their =20 content,
it's important to include them in on the decision of what =20 kind of CMS,
because they are going to be the ones working in it all =20 the time.

Give em testdrives, I say...

Cheers,
-Sharon

On Feb 27, 2008, at 7:19 AM, Katherine Gray wrote:

>
> Here's what my client is looking for, in general (I've got them =20 
> working on specific requirements right now):
>
> 1. Update navigation, text, graphics
> 2. Import pre-made graphic callouts to mix and match will 3. Send info 
> to Eloqua (still fuzzy on this, got them working on it) 4. See and 
> manage folder system effectively - this will be a 250+ page site
>
> I worry that the blog solutions are just not robust enough. But they 
> keep saying "CMS Light!" I don't think they realize how light CMSs can 
> be now.
>
> -Katherine
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: webproducers-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> [mailto:webproducers-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Michael =20 
> Cervieri
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 4:13 PM
> To: webproducers@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [webproducers] Re: request for proposal
>
> i was going to say that without requirements it's difficult to 
> recommend a solution.
>
> for example in the open source community:
>
> * a lightweight cms that lets us update a marketing site with blog 
> attached to it
> ** wordpress does nicely.
>
> * a community site that where different content is displayed pre and 
> post login
> ** drupal's my preferred. joomla, for the most part, is the same
>
> * community inter-communication site, perhaps tied to learning
> ** elgg
>
> * digg like community platform
> ** pligg
>
> it come's down to what you're trying to accomplish, choosing the 
> platform that accomplishes the majority of that while simultaneously 
> being open enough that you can either develop on top of it, or fuse it 
> with another solution that accomplishes still more of your goals.
>
> michael
>
> On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Richard Ryan =20 
> <richardryannyc@xxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>> To my mind Plone on Zope remains the best (or at least  one of the 
>> best) open source CMSes.  But despite its  sophistication and object 
>> oriented nature - ideal for  larger enterprises - Plone support 
>> remains challenging  for smaller organizations, simply because Python  
>> developers are hard to come by.
>>
>>  For an enterprise-strength proprietary package, you  should 
>> definitely be looking at Fatwire's CS7 or  Percussion's Rhythmyx.
>>
>>  For review and ongoing input (including a blog and
>>  newsletter) on CMS issues and vendors generally:
>>
>>  www.cmswatch.com
>>
>>  Regards,
>>  Richard
>>
>
> --=3D20
> /********************************
> Michael Cervieri
> Executive Producer
> ScribeMedia.Org
> michael@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Reporting AIDS Emmy Nomination:
> http://www.scribemedia.org/shows/reporting-aids/
> ********************************/
>
>
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