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[lit-ideas] Re: Moderate Muslims

From: "Simon Ward" <sedward@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 22:27:49 +0100

"Simon's polling information, which I haven't yet looked at, doesn't seem to directly address this issue [the relative silence of moderates]. It identifies some self-identified moderate Muslim opinion in Britain, but doesn't indicate to what extent that data is reliable."

I included these polls to establish some quanitifiable statements about the extent of moderates amongst British Muslims. Though these polls suggest what muslims feel to be the reasons for terrorism (in particular the July bombings in London), they don't and can't deal with the reasons why specific moderates might make the journey into extremism. Those specifics can only come from statements made by extremists, which is why I thought that the 'martyrdom videos' were good evidence.

What the polls do achieve, in my opinion, is to put the lie to the scare-mongering labelled, among other things, Londinistan. That 94 per cent of respondents disagreed that muslims should live seperately from non-muslims is quite illuminating and there are other stats that do just as good a job. And this is why these Islamophobic statements from western commentators make me annoyed, thay seem to deal in mythologies and urban legends rather than secure statistics.

Eric includes quotes saying that (to choose one): "...a terrifying number of the world's Muslims now view all political and moral questions in terms of their affiliation with Islam."

Yet in the main, this only applies to vocal extremists rather than the moderate majority. And this is another source of annoyance. British Muslims weren't pleased at the Danish Cartoons, the polls confirm that, yet the numbers of protesters in Britain may not have exceeded a hundred. Of course, it was these people who appeared on TV, not the vast majority sitting at home shaking their heads. How many fundamentlist christians demonstrate in America when things in the world annoy them?

As regards the MCB, I'm not surprised that it has connections with more extreme elements of Islam, but far more important is that it operates within the constraints of the British Political System. It has, I would suggest, stronger connections with the British Foreign Office and with Govt in general. If this wasn't the case, it would be of greater concern.

Simon

----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Yost" <eyost1132@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 9:16 PM Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Moderate Muslims

Robert: This is a paradigm of the sort of reasoning ('Harris says...') Lawrence dismissed . . .Of course, this may not have been meant as an argument.

Eric: It's not meant as an argument; it's an attempt to present a topic for discussion. The topic is whether there is ... "every reason to believe that a terrifying number of the world's Muslims now view all political and moral questions in terms of their affiliation with Islam. This leads them to rally to the cause of other Muslims no matter how sociopathic their behavior."

Canadian author Irshad Manji has noticed this trend and written _The Trouble with Islam Today_ to address it. The problem as she sees it is that
http://www.muslim-refusenik.com/thebook.html#troublewithislamis
"only in Islam is literalism mainstream. Which means that when abuse happens under the banner of Islam, most Muslims have no clue how to dissent, debate, revise or reform."

Manji has started Project Ijtihad, which she describes as "our foundation to spur a reform in Islam — a reform that enables the emerging generation of Muslims, especially young women, to challenge authoritarianism and restore Islam’s tradition of critical thinking."
In "A Moderate Muslim view of Islamic Terrorism, "
http://www.crescentlife.com/heal%20the%20world/moderate_muslim_view_of_islamic_terrorism.htm
Kamal Nawash writes that "Fundamentalist Islamic terror represents one of the most lethal threats to the stability of the civilized world . . . ."

"So far, the few Muslims who choose to speak up against militant extremist Islam have faced threats of violence and accusations of being anti-Islam. In effect, the message disseminated by radical Muslims is that merely discussing Islamic terrorism is to be construed as an attack on Islam."

Simon's polling information, which I haven't yet looked at, doesn't seem to directly address this issue. It identifies some self-identified moderate Muslim opinion in Britain, but doesn't indicate to what extent that data is reliable. For example, see:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1548786,00.html Radical links of UK's 'moderate' Muslim group The Muslim Council of Britain has been courted by the government and lauded by the Foreign Office but critics tell a different and more disturbing story.
or
http://www.muslim-refusenik.com/news/newyorktimes-2006-08-16.html
In the wake of the London bombings on July 7, 2005, Iqbal Sacranie, then the head of the influential Muslim Council of Britain, insisted that economic discrimination lay at the root of Islamist radicalism in his country. When it came to light that some of the suspects enjoyed middle-class upbringings, university educations, jobs and cars, Mr. Sacranie found a new culprit: foreign policy. In so doing, he boarded the groupthink express steered by Muslim elites
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[lit-ideas] Re: Moderate Muslims
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[lit-ideas] Re: Moderate Muslims

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