hello firstly a correction (typo) it should be "causal" (cause and effect/affect) rather than "casual": "this leaves the performers with causal and patterned responses" greetings to nathaniel, our previous dialogue seems relevant here; hence the "effect/affect". i don't find massumi's concepts apply well to (contact)improvisation ... 'effect/affect' still seems open to debate. perhaps we can talk about effect/affect and interaction via a simple, real world example: - physical touch and a track pad. we all familiar with this interface, and members of the list have performed / critiqued it. lets assume a single finger, and single point tracking ... everything else 'is game'. ... trackpads 'read' the capacitance (stored electrical charge) of the surface. this is read through a matrix (gird) or field at 20-400 kHz (approx.). the derived coordinates (and inferred motion) can be mapped/used in a variety of ways. human touch is 'read' via signals (chemical/electrical) from sensory receptors and neurons. the frequency of the signals increases with the strength of the stimuli. the amplitude (strength) of the signal remains constant. ... the basic perception/actions of touch i work with are: - sensation (experience) - communication (intention) i'm not going to describe the experiential here, you can do that for yourself. the framework for sensate touch is: - absence of touch - accidental touch - receiving touch - for self (but not other) - for other (but not self) - shared synchronous (same sensation) - shared asynchronous (different sensations) this comes from (contact)improvisation work, but seems to apply to all touch. one example of 'touch for self (but not other)' would be using your fingernail on the trackpad. the fingernail offers no capacitance and thus will not 'register'. it is an unsubtle example, but useful none the less. communicative touch can be used to: - asses your intention/interaction - to convey intention (to others) - to respond to intention (from others) with regards to communication / intention we can: - ignore - yield - resist - redirect - return i can explain these if required, but i'd rather move on for now. there is a (structural) complexity to the perception of touch. this is before we start thinking about the 'effect/affect'. these modes of perception inform the real-time reading and composition. they can disrupt causal/patterned responses. a single 'sensation' has many readings/responses readings/responses to interactions/obejects can be framed as: - representation (mapping) - interpretation (abstraction) of course, the trackpad cannot read all the subtleties of theses perceptual modes. is doesn't need to. two discrete systems interacting can lead to a 'combined' system with emergent properties. so, who want to offer the 'perceptual' modes we can 'read' the track-pad data through? nathan, tony? and perhaps we can have some commentary on the 'experience' of the modes of touch i have described? or simply critique. we can on expand (and implement?) this simple test case to explore the 'post-choreographic'. best matt ... ps can i propose a 500 word limit per post? to keep everything flowing and (relatively) quick to read?